Lucem Fero | Interviews | Headhunter

Rebirth - Destruction frontman Schmier unleashes the revival of nineties project Headhunter

By Anthony Morgan

After almost a decade accredited as one third of the Big Three of Teutonic Thrash, the mighty Destruction wished to take their frantic riffery into a more technical direction. Frontman Marcel “Schmier” Schirmer didn't figure in these plans, and so the bassist / vocalist was unceremoniously ousted. A brief union with singer André yielded 1990's Cracked Brain, yet the title bore an uncanny similarity to the song name “Crack Brained”. The group in question? Headhunter, fronted by none other than erstwhile frontman Schmier. Uwe “Schmuddel” Hoffmann, boasting a stint in Talon to his credit, occupied guitars. Meanwhile, Jörg Michael stood in behind the drumkit. Michael's CV is rather hefty, notching up residencies with Rage, Axel Rudi Pell, Saxon, Stratovarius and Mekong Delta during a long yet varied career. Traditional yet melodic, Headhunter paid tribute to many of Schmier's heroes.

1990's Parody Of Life used some ideas originally conceived for Destruction, so therefore became the group's hardest sounding effort. Also, its celebrated front sleeve sported the stringed headhunter. 1992's sophomore follow up A Bizarre Gardening Accident turned out to be more fully realised, adopting a diversified approach which combined hardness with melody. 1994's Rebirth took the melodic aspect a stage further, yet fostered a special place in Schmier's heart. After those three respectable full lengths, the group parted ways in mid 1996.

An inevitable reunion with Destruction occurred in 1999, and each specific member gained a newfound maturity, and respect for one another. Since that time, Destruction has gone from strength to strength. They've conducted successful global dates, and issued such decent offerings as All Hell Breaks Loose (2000) and Inventor of Evil (2005). Having said that, the ghost of Headhunter was never laid to rest. Given a fresh release of life via AFM Records during September 2007, all three Headhunter albums were released with a remastered sound, a new booklet with pictures, liner notes and lyrics. This inspired a reassembling of the original lineup, and a tentative fourth album is due in spring 2008. Destruction's twenty-fifth anniversary also looms, and a celebratory CD during August 2008 is on the cards. It'll include bonus material from the group's 2007 Wacken Open Air performance, and a documentary chronicling the life and times of the German Thrash act. Besides that, a live DVD has been promised for late 2008. Destruction plan to return to the UK for a string of club dates during November 2007, and have recruited Bristol's Onslaught as weighty support. With all that in mind, Schmier spoke to Lucem Fero. A talkative individual, he proves to be a model interviewee who has no qualms in airing his views.

Hello?
Hi. Is this Anthony?
Yeah, this is Anthony. Is this Schmier?
Hi, this is Schmier. Hi.
How are you?
I'm fine, thank you. I'm a little late, but it's been a busy day and...
Yeah, I know what you mean. It's alright. Is it alright if I start the questions now?
Sure, whenever you're ready.
Thank you. Could you tell me when you got the idea of bringing Headhunter back to life?
Yeah, it's always been in demand. I was very busy with Destruction over the last few years, but people always kept asking about Headhunter. Over the last few years, I've had plenty of ideas and riffs. They possibly wouldn't have fit in Destruction, and that's because they were more traditionally Metal somewhat. On the outset, Destruction was very very busy touring and releasing albums. Since we had a little bit more space this year, I considered at least re-releasing the Headhunter albums for the first time. Many people have always been asking for their re-release in the last seven or eight years, and it's almost been a pain in the ass question; “When will the Headhunter albums get re-released?”. They haven't been released anywhere in the world except for Germany, neighbouring countries and Japan. I was surprised about that, and so there was some major discussion as to why it all started first of all. Right now, it feels good. To me, it's a nice, extra opportunity, outside of Destruction, to do something that also deals with music.
When you came up with these more traditional riffs, did you immediately think that they could be for Headhunter?
Between Mike and me, songwriting is a kind of deal. We work on the songs like partners, although Mike is really freaky about riffs and things. He doesn't like to be too melodic, and wants to be outrageous. Also, he dislikes riffs that have been there before - he wants the riffs to be like his playing. When I come up with riffs that maybe fit more with the vocals, he always says something like “Ahh, it feels as though the harmony has been there before”. It's a normal process to write songs with Destruction; when we write new material, it has to be Destruction. Therefore, sometimes I don't even bring up many of the ideas that I have for Destruction. I know they don't fit with the band well, and that's because they're too traditional. Traditional is great, but if you ever asked us why we named the band Destruction then we always said that it was because it's a destruction of music. We were never really known for using harmonies that are really melodic or catchy somewhat, so therefore I'm using all the things that I'm writing for Headhunter. It's fun as I couldn't use all those riffs last year for Destruction, and that's because we've been fully concentrating on Destruction's material. Destruction's material has to be aggressive, overly technical, outstandingly different and has to fit the style. Those riffs are not leftovers; those riffs are just riffs that I'm constantly playing, and riffs that I'm constantly collecting. The fun thing about music is that you can use your output somewhere elsewhere, so I'm happy I can use this time to record some material that's certainly going to be released now. That's really good.
How do you fit Headhunter around Destruction's schedule?
This was the first year I had time to think about it, and that's why it didn't happen earlier. The re-releases are out now though. I'm a person that takes things seriously; when I do something, I do it right. I don't want to something in between, or do something that is getting in the way. I took my time with it. I've been with Destruction now for eight years; we've written and released a new album nearly every year, toured the world and been really busy. Headhunter is just a nice hobby. It's nice for me to have a chance to release those albums, and do an actual album with Headhunter again. Basically, those Headhunter albums were never released worldwide.
Do you feel more relaxed when you're working within Headhunter then?
Yeah, of course. There's no pressure. With Destruction, we're a band with a legacy. Meanwhile, we're taking things easier than we did in the past. We know what we do right, and we know how to do it. With Destruction, there's a certain pressure. That's because it's our life, and it's the whole thing that keeps us alive. If a Destruction album doesn't sound right, or if there's something out there like it, then it's a big disaster for us. For Headhunter though, this is more important. You can just move along as you like, and there's no real pressure. We just go out there, compose some tracks and use the major influences from Thrash and NWOBHM. We just write the material that we really like, and that's the thing that was always good with Headhunter. We've raised Headhunter again. After being fired from Destruction, it had no pressure. I got caught up with it because I was fired, though it was fun for me to go on. It's the same thing now. I don't need Headhunter to be successful as such; I do this because the fans are asking for it, and because I'm a musician. I would also like to express myself in a different way than I do with Destruction, and that's as I have more to offer. This is why it's just a win for me, so it's great fun.
Musically speaking, you have more freedom in Headhunter then?
Of course. There's more pressure in Destruction, and that's as it has to be Destruction. With some melodic things, Destruction doesn't shit. Some ideas that I write don't fit with Destruction, so of course I have more freedom with Headhunter to write other ideas down. These other ideas are possibly more open, more Heavy Metal, more... I don't know - we say that it's more traditional. Destruction has to be very aggressive, and it has to be more technical. Micheal, my partner in songwriting, doesn't accept much harmonies or too much riffs that have been there before. I don't mind sometimes using a riff that may have been written in the past - sometimes we just realise it later on. With Destruction, it's important to be original and to be destructive. The music of Destruction is a vital part of the band, so we're not going to compromise this. Therefore, Headhunter is a nice hobby for me and a nice challenge for me to sing a little more melodic. I am a destructive force, but I can also sing a little more melodic. This is a nice challenge to use some melody, but without being cheesy. I'm an eighties freak, and I really like the idea of going back to the eighties once in a while.
With Destruction, do you have the pressure of living up to the Destruction albums from the eighties?
No, not really. The pressure for us is just to deliver very strong music, and strong songs. We don't want to repeat ourselves too much; we don't want go back and say “We have to release another Infernal Overkill (1985)”, or feel we have to write a second “Bestial Invasion” track or something. It's important to stay original, and to stay strong. Also, it's important to use the technical abilities of the band in order to measure us against all the new bands out there. We were European inventors of new music somewhat. They always look at us, and what we're doing. Even if Thrash Metal wasn't always the taste of the day or the time, there was still of course more pressure on Destruction.
Although Mike doesn't like to use harmonies in his own songwriting, is he still a fan of some bands which use harmonies and so on?
There's no problem with him when it comes to harmonies, but the actual problem is the way you use harmonies. A lot of those new bands are just overdoing the harmonies.
Yeah, I agree.
When we started Destruction, it was about being destructive. It was about treading away from the usual harmonies, and bringing in some more diverse things. We're still trying to do that, and also keep with the style of the band. Of course, we all know how it works. More people like harmonies, and harmony music is always more successful. On the other hand, music with no harmonies isn't as successful. With Destruction though, it doesn't matter. What matters is being aggressive, and protecting the style of aggressive music. Our music has been forgotten for awhile, and even in the last few years there have been Melodic Death Metal groups and so on. It doesn't mean you wish to play it though. We're trying to keep the aggressive way alive; aggressiveness is still having the edge, and the catchiness. That's our trademark, and what we're trying to do.
So musically speaking, you feel that Destruction will always be Destruction and Headhunter will always be Headhunter? What I mean by that is Destruction will not end up incorporating Headhunter type influences.
Exactly. Destruction is our dark, aggressive side. With Headhunter, I can play material that is more traditional and more melodic. We're not talking about melodic in a cheesy way; we're talking about decent harmonies which are still heavy. For Destruction, it's always been a different thing. We always did that because that's what we're there for, and that's what we wanted to do from day one. I think it's sometimes important to define your style, and that's because not many bands from those days had the originality to do that. We're real lucky that we have the originality to be Destruction, and to be this band which has a trademark. We're definitely setting a trademark. Anything I want to do outside of that, I do it in a different way. I don't want to water down Destruction with some other things that don't fit in well. Headhunter is my second thing; Headhunter, as much as I like it, is just a hobby. It's my passion for straightforward Heavy Metal. Destruction is my life, and my lifestyle. It's a far different thing.
You'll be recording a new Headhunter album, and it'll be released next year. Is that correct?
We're working on the album right now, and we would love to release the album straight away. I hope it's going to happen in 2008, and we'll see how special it's going to be. We're feeling so good now that we're going to be able at least to bring out the album during spring next year. At least in the beginning of 2008, we can play some festivals with Headhunter. That would be really great.
Due to that, does this mean Destruction will be on a break for a few months after touring Thrash Anthems?
Thrash Anthems was already a breather for us; we didn't release a new album, so it wasn't a full time job this time. That was important as we've been working hard since 1999; we've released a new album every year almost, and toured and so on. Thrash Anthems was a break for the band. Destruction will release a new album next year, and it'll be the twenty-fifth anniversary album for the band. It'll have lots of surprises, and it'll include some DVDs and so on. It'll be out on August 27^th 2008 - it's already planned. After that, we're going to do a big world tour for our twenty-fifth anniversary. In between that, I have some time to pursue other things. There won't be a real break for Destruction, and that's because we're going to hit the studio in roughly February or something. We're playing right now; we've come back from some shows, and we're going to hit Japan next week. We're also going to come to the UK soon, and play some festivals in between. We're very busy, and it's good to be busy with Destruction as it's my life.
As you're pursuing two bands at the moment, does that help keep things fresh musically speaking?
I didn't get the whole question. If you're asking me if I'm now putting Destruction on ice, or...
No, I'm not asking that. What I mean is...
No, no. Let me continue.
Ok.
Destruction is always my full priority, but there's a downside as you said though. If you have a band that you're working for daily, then it's a full time job. With Destruction, we're playing so much. I'm working hard for the band, so it's becoming a daily routine. For me, something like Headhunter is a common outlet. I can just do something else in between, and it gives me some reason to play with other musicians. I can write some other material, so it's just a break from the daily routine. Destruction, for me of course, is more important than ever. I can connect to my main band, and be in full power, and full awareness, of what we're doing. Also, I don't have to be frustrated due to the fact that some of the things I write are not fitting in with the band. For me, it's a really positive thing at this moment in time. I don't know how we can go on with Headhunter though; it's going to depend on how the album turns out. It's just a big relief for me to have a good time, and to do something else in between. Thus then, it doesn't become a daily routine in Destruction.
Judging by what you just said, are you getting the impression that the press are possibly trying to imply that you're getting frustrated within Destruction? False claims?
No, not really. I just get this idea that now I need a break from Destruction. It's true; I'm a workaholic, and I like to be busy. This was just a chance to finally fight back with something, and that was important for me. Destruction is my main thing, and it always will be. Unless the band breaks up, there'll be no chance to take it easy as I'm doing something else. Destruction is the main thing for me; it's my life, and it has been my life for a long time. I'm very happy that we are in a position to do what we're doing. This isn't just a chance to say that I need a break, or something. I should say it like this; other people have different, nice hobbies, and they have the chance to express themselves in a different way. The Headhunter project is a good idea, and I appreciate this so much. I appreciate it so much, and that's since I know so many young bands out there don't even get a record deal. So many young talents out there don't get the chance to get a record deal. I came up with Headhunter though, and I got a record deal right away. Of course, this isn't fair to those young bands in some respects. I appreciate this situation a lot, believe me. There's nothing more important in my life than music. It's a good opportunity, and it's also a good opportunity to show people that Headhunter wasn't a poor alternative. We wrote some good material, and we're going to write some good material that is just traditional Heavy Metal. If you guys don't like it, then fuck off. I don't care. Not so many bands are writing this kind of material anymore. It's also a forgotten style somewhat, so I'm looking forward to the album.
When I asked my question, I didn't mean it in a bad way. What I meant was..
I understand, but I just want to basically explain that people are asking from both sides. I don't know if you're asking the question in a bad way, or in a good way. So, I'm just trying to explain. The thing is that you can ask things in different ways, and the intention is a different one than people may think sometimes.
You do Headhunter, and then do you feel refreshed when you return to Destruction?
Yeah. You can have a main job, and then go out to a different job. If you're successful in your other job too though, you come back to your main job feeling really powerful and successful overall. It helps the main band as well, and that's the thing. I'm a full time musician, and I like to be busy. I don't like to hang around either, so that's a great thing. It's funny that all these people are now giving me a great response about Headhunter, and that's because I don't know how this all happened. They were small label releases in the nineties at the time Death Metal was popular - traditional Thrash and Heavy Metal was really dead. It's a great honour for the Heavy Metal scene that people didn't forget those albums, and that there's great demand for those albums too. I'm happy for the chance, and anything else is just a gift. If anything else happens, then I don't care. For me, it's an opportunity to play music. I'm a big Metal fan. I don't care about sales, and I don't need Headhunter to survive. Believe me, there's no real money involved in Headhunter. It's just for fun.
What were the other Headhunter band members like when you approached them with the idea of getting back together?
It came up when I remastered the tracks, and that's as I had to listen to the songs over and over. I almost forgot how many great songs were on those albums. Also, I forgot how many nice anthems there were and how the style of Headhunter was different. You can call it Power Metal, but it's not even Power Metal. It's between all the genres; it's nice, and it's no-one's style. When I did the remasters, I realised this again. I wrote a song for a friend of mine, and that's because it was his birthday. His biggest wish was to have a song written about his work, so I wrote him a song. It's called “Silver Skull”, and that's the name of his place. It's more in the traditional style of Headhunter. When he and others heard the song, they were all freaking out. They all said “Oh my god, this is way different than Destruction”, and commented that it's so much more catchy and traditional than Destruction's music. The song is so good that it just gave me the kick up the ass to say; “Man, you're writing songs like this? So why don't you form Headhunter again? With Destruction, you can't do it”. That gave me the chance to call the guys again, and say; “Hey, what's up? I've got plenty of riffs, and they're fucking getting dusty here. Why don't we sit together, and talk?”. The most funny thing was when I contacted Jörg Michael, the drummer of Stratovarius. I wrote him an email saying; “Are you busy? I understand if you can't do Headhunter, and I know that I can't give you the money that you need for Headhunter. Think about playing on the album, or we'll hire another guy”. He wrote back one sentence, and that was; “Another other guy that plays with Headhunter is a dead guy”. I felt ok about his reply, and Jörg's attitude was the right attitude. We don't need people that are thinking about making money from Headhunter. Headhunter is about playing together, and playing the right music. It's a good laugh, and that's why it was so easy to get the band together again. It's been some years, but they were some fun years. It's great to see the band again, and we got nothing to lose.
Was it real cool seeing the guys again?
Yeah, of course it was. The strangest thing was writing the first song, and wondering whether it was was going to work. It was exactly like the first song we wrote for Parody Of Life, the first album. We just started writing, and came out with some riffs and ideas. The song was written in roughly two hours. Musical chemistry just works, or doesn't work. Therefore, Headhunter has always been a fun band - it always worked pretty good. Without that, we couldn't do a comeback. It's not even a comeback album; it's just another album. We never really split up, but just went in different directions. If it didn't work, then we wouldn't record an album. Jörg Michael and myself play in bands that have some quality, so this album has to have some quality. We don't even mind, and that's as we know it's going to have some quality. Wee just do it for a laugh really. We're looking forward to it, so it's cool. It's lots of fun, and I think the biggest joy is the fun. Destruction is pressurising, and about retaining the band's legacy. Headhunter is about just going out there, and rocking the fucking shit out of your body.
(Laughs) When the new Headhunter album is released next year, is there anything that the fans may not expect?
Spoiling surprises is somewhat boring, though we're trying to keep it the way it is. The next album is definitely going to be heavier, and a little harder, than the Rebirth album. We'll be retaining the whole melodic lead guitar in the songs, and the whole catchiness of the chorus. It's just going to possibly be a little more up to date than Rebirth was, an album we wrote in 1993. It's definitely going to be a mixture of Parody Of Life, which was more rough, and Rebirth, which was more melodic. It's going to keep the balance between those two albums, but with an up to date production that is still old school. Of course, there's going to be some funny parts. Headhunter has to be funny, and that's as we like to enjoy ourselves in the studio. Of course, there'll be some funny intros. We're going to bring the stringed headhunter back on the cover, which was on the first one.
Alright, that sounds cool.
Yeah, I like that. When I look back on those days, the first cover was killer. I don't know why we didn't continue with that one. Of course though there was a problem with the management and the record label at the time. When the album comes to light in January, or whenever it comes out, it's going to have the stringed headhunter back on the cover somehow. That's going to be a trademark of the band.
Is that almost making a statement that Headhunter are back?
Yeah, of course. I think it's always good to have something like a trademark. I have a tattoo of the fucking stringed headhunter, and it's been an important part of my life. Why shouldn't I think about that? I don't know why we didn't use it again in the nineties, but I think there were some legal issues or something. It was a big trademark for the band I think. In those days, there were not many Headhunter shirts out there. If I see a shirt, then it's the Parody Of Life cover. It looks good, and it's just a great fucking trademark.
Is that a mascot then, or am I getting mistaken?
I wouldn't call it a mascot, though it's a trademark. It becomes a mascot when we do some more albums. If you're talking about a mascot, then the band has to continue to do some more records. I think it's coming back now as it's a trademark of the band, like using the same kind of logo for example. We used a logo on the first album, and the logo on that album was just more Metal. I love that influence, and now we're old enough to have the power to control everything we do. Back in the nineties, we didn't have the power. There were too many managers, and too many different record labels. I couldn't take a position in Destruction at the time, so I formed this band. They respected my point of view, so I could do a lot more with Headhunter than I could do in the past. It's a great opportunity.
I know you mentioned the first Headhunter album, so can you tell me about the Headhunter reissues which came out this month?
Basically, we didn't have any bonus tracks. The chance to reissue the albums was for the fans asking for those records, and I don't want Destruction fans to pay too much money for bad bootlegs or anything. This way, we had the opportunity to remaster the albums in order to have a unique sound. They're from the nineties, yet those remasters sound really good. Rebirth especially sounds really really well. I feel like comparing it to Painkiller; it had the same edge, and had the same kind of intention. This is really nice, and that's because Rebirth is also a few years old now. The fact we had the chance to remaster the albums was the great thing about these re-releases. The albums have a lot more low-end, and the choruses have some more power now. We got some annoyingly high ends in there also, but it was fun to do that. It's great to basically use some things in a different direction, and just make it better. We had the chance to do that, and it goes with the cover of Parody Of Life. It's perfect, and anything afterwards wasn't as perfect. We changed the covers a little bit, but not too much. We made some cool additions; all the albums have additional liner notes, and additional lyrics. They weren't on all the albums, and there are more pictures too. They're nice reissues, and we wanted them to be nice-price. If you see the albums, want to buy them and they're more than roughly twelve euros each, then distance yourselve. Distance yourself as they're nice-price albums, and are being regularly sold for less than twelve euros. If you see that people are not selling them as nice-price editions, then you should complain. Alternatively, write to the band via our MySpace and we'll try to take care of that. We put a lot of effort into them, and we don't want to charge the fans too much for them as they're just reissues. The bonus tracks didn't happen in the end, but we put a lot of hard graft into those releases to just make them good for the fans.
So you're really really happy about the fact that the albums are being sold so cheaply?
Yeah. When Destruction came back in 1999, I already had an offer to re-release the Headhunter albums at that time. I got another offer every two weeks from other labels, but I didn't want to do it as I wanted to do it right. Therefore, I'm really happy that we tried to do it the best way we could. All the albums have some slight changes; we changed the colour a little bit, so some people have said “Oh, they're not the same colour”. Those re-releases are not for fans that already have the albums though. Those reissues are, first of all, for the fans that don't have the albums yet want to buy them. Before, they were just released in Japan, Germany and some neighbouring countries. They were never released in the UK, in South America, in the United States and some other major markets. It's great to have the opportunity to do that. I feel like it's a gift, so we tried to it the best way we could.
Do you get fans coming up to you to talk about Headhunter? Fans who may have never heard of Headhunter before the reissues?
Many young people have heard of Headhunter, and have possibly heard some songs before. Now they finally have the chance to listen to Headhunter first of all, so that's a cool thing. I know that a lot of Destruction fans are not going to buy the albums as they're not heavy enough - all the Destruction maniacs like their music more thrashy. On Destruction's board at www.destruction.de though, we have a lot of fans who've been demanding for the Headhunter albums to be re-released for years. Basically, it's great to see that. I guess there's plenty of thrashers that also like their music more traditional sometimes, and it's cool to see that. I know that Headhunter is not brutal and heavy enough for the Destruction fans though, for sure.
When a group re-releases an album with bonus tracks, does that piss you off? Some bands do that almost on purpose.
If we had some bonus tracks, then I would give them to the fans. We don't have anything though, and that wasn't the intention. The Headhunter albums were just released such a long time ago. the intention was not to re-release an album that was released once, and then released again. Actually, the intention was to finally give all the Destruction fans the chance to listen to the Headhunter albums. Many people were just asking, and asking, and kept on asking, and it got somewhat annoying after awhile. People didn't believe that I could do it. I'm a guy that's looking for a challenge, and I think for me it was important to give this to the Destruction fans. Of course, I was going to re-release the Headhunter albums at the right time. I didn't want to make much cash out of it, but wanted to give them a chance to buy them at the right price. They can still choose if they want to buy them or not, so that was an important step towards the whole thing.
The first Headhunter album Parody Of Life came after you originally split with Destruction. Could you tell me about that album, and where you were musically at that time?
Of course. After the split, I had plenty of riffs and lyrics from Destruction which evolved into Parody Of Life.That's why Parody Of Life is also, of course, the most Destruction-esque Headhunter album. WIth A Bizarre Gardening Incident, we tried to change. I think we always tried to be unlike Destruction, or anything. After the split, a major step for me was to not sound like Destruction. Many people expected me to possibly get another group together, and just try to sound like Destruction. That was somewhat unnecessary, and not really important. For me, it was important to write the material that I had been collecting in a different way. This was likely more into the direction which Destruction had kept away from, which was more catchy Metal somewhat. Meanwhile, Destruction was more into technical material pretty much. For me, it was always important to go into a more diverse direction than Destruction did.
On Parody Of Life, you used some riffs which were originally meant for Destruction. Is that correct?
Yeah, that's correct. I used some vocal lines, and some choruses. Remember, the first Destruction album after I left was called Cracked Brain. On the first Headhunter album, there was a song called “Crack Brained”. Basically, what happened at this time was that they stole my idea about the chorus and used it for Destruction. I had written those lines, and they used them on the album.
To be blunt, did that really fuck you off?
These may not be the right words. I called the guys, and said “Fuck off. You kick me out, and then use my titles? What the fuck is wrong with you?”. They said “Yeah, but we decided that it's so good that we should use it”. I told them to fuck off, but they still used it. I didn't want to sue them, and that's because we were together for just so long. Instead of suing them, I just kept the same type of title for the first Headhunter album. Also, I wrote some new lyrics for it. I've been trying to keep back a little as concerns that. At the end of the day, I'm not the kind of guy that... How do you say that? Dirty dishes? What do you call it in the English language? When it just keeps on, and...
When you say bad things about each other, and so on?
What do you call that in English? If you say bad things? Is it dirty clothes, or something? I don't know.
Dirty laundry?
Dirty laundry! Yeah, that's it.
Dirty laundry in public.
Good, ok. Now I've learnt some good English. You can't air your dirty laundry just to backstab others, ok? That's good, and it's interesting.
You keep your dirty laundry in private rather than showing it in public.
Exactly, and that's the same thing with Sifringer and me somewhat. I didn't want to do that, but they basically did that to me for awhile. I never really cared, and that's as you have to come back with good music. I was always happy with the fact that Parody Of Life is a good album. It came just after the split, and that's maybe why it was the thrashiest Headhunter album.
Would you say that Headhunter was finding its feet on that album?
It's definitely been important to not sound like Destruction, and to not sound like another Thrash band - I wanted to go away from that. I was just learning about technical ability, and about aggressiveness. I thought “let's go away from that”. I'm a Metal fan, first of all, and I can do something else too. I wanted Headhunter to be the most aggressive band after Destruction. Of course, that changed. It's right that you say that, and that's since we tried to take Headhunter in a more traditional, melodic direction. During those months prior to the split, there hadn't been diversity within Destruction. We didn't want to use any traditional experiments at all anymore; we wanted to be just technical, and faster. As a result, the leads had to be more technical. I think it didn't have anything to do with the roots of the band anymore, which were traditional Heavy Metal and Punk Rock. For Headhunter, I was just free to do what I wanted. I wanted to do something more catchy. Basically, it was a good release.
When groups really focus on being technical and somewhat obsess about it, do you feel they possibly lose sight of the passion sometimes? Does that make sense?
Yeah, it makes sense. For Destruction though, it was somewhat strange. Of course, we wanted to move forward. We wanted to go in further directions, and be thrashier live and so on. It was just too fast though, the way... Also, other musicians that came into the band later on tried to force the band into being more technical and different. It's difficult to say. I'm totally up for progression; I love progressive music totally, and I'm a big fan of that style. If it's my own baby though, then I'm concerned about what we do right and what we should do. At that time, it broke Destruction's neck. For example, there's the progressiveness of an album like Release from Agony. That was the best selling Destruction album in Japan, and South America. Also, it was a very important album for the Death Metal market later on. It's always difficult to say what is wrong or right. At that moment though, it just didn't personally feel real to go constantly more technical. It happened, and we had to go in different directions. You have to go your own way, and learn. We were also pretty young kids at the time...
Did you talk about those type of things when you came back with Destruction eight years ago? Did you discuss all those specific issues and so on?
We've been talking about those issues, of course. We've been talking about the direction, and what Destruction is all about. Also, we've been talking about things that we did wrong in the past. That was the main reason to move on. Mike and me were very young; we were fourteen or fifteen when we first met, and when we started the band etc. I told him I wanted to discuss what went wrong, and what's important to him and so on. What's important is having such thoughts, and so you talk about mistakes. Without that, we couldn't go on and continue. It was an important step. In the last couple of years. It was good to see all those old members, that were causing tension somewhat at the time. They all came back to me, and apologised. They said; “We're sorry. We were just young, and we wanted to be technical. We wanted to be crazy, but we didn't understand that Destruction doesn't work without you as the singer”. After all those years, it was a great to see they still realised that we made some mistakes. Without mistakes though, you don't learn. Life is all about learning, and making mistakes sometimes. I'm lucky to be in the position to be back in the band for the last few years now. Everything else has just been different for some years, and I never thought it was going to happen like this again. So, that's cool.
You said that the second Headhunter album A Bizarre Gardening Accident came to form the typical Headhunter style. Could you tell me about that specific album, and how it came to form the style you referred to?
On that album, and for the first time, we used a producer who really wanted to have a UK, eighties style production. We wanted to go back to the roots where we belong, rather than keep the traditional Destruction style prevalent on Parody Of Life. On A Bizarre Gardening Accident, I think where we possibly went wrong was just going back a step too far. Still, I think it learning how to produce my voice on melodic parts was a big step for us. My voice is still rough, filthy and scratchy. I can still sing really melodic material though, and it just sounds handsome. It doesn't sound like fucking childish bullshit, and still sounds Metal. That's what we learnt on the A Bizarre Gardening Accident album I think, and it was a major step for us at that point. We thought we could be more melodic, but without being cheesy. Therefore, A Bizarre Gardening Accident was a good album. I think it's possibly the weakest album of the Headhunter trilogy though - I think Parody Of Life and Rebirth are the best ones. I think it was an album where we were finding ourselves, and where the band learnt how we were together and so on. So, it was an important album.
You said that A Bizarre Gardening Accident went too far back, so in that do you mean it sounded dated in some respects? Is that what you meant?
At the time, all the Destruction fans still expected us to be rougher and more brutal. Headhunter didn't want to go more brutal though; at that time, Headhunter wanted to go more traditional. You have to remember; this was in 1991-92, and Death Metal was getting huge. Dismember, Obituary and groups like them really wanted to have this screaming, gory, really rough material. We were totally wrong in what we were doing, and that's since we chose an older style which was more popular in the past. There were not many Heavy Metal bands going on at that time, and from the other side there was a scene in the Seattle area with Nirvana, Soundgarden and groups like that. Heavy Metal was not very popular at this time, let me tell you. If you think back, even Iron Maiden and acts like Judas Priest were going through their bad years. So, imagine how difficult it was for Headhunter. It wasn't easy.
During that time, Heavy Metal sales were low weren't they?
Yeah, it wasn't a good time for Heavy Metal at all. Also, we then we lost our record deal.
Do you feel that was due to the fact that groups like Nirvana and Soundgarden were popular?
Yeah, and then we were looking for a record deal for Headhunter. I called a guy from a very well known European label in Netherlands, and he told me “Schmier, cut your hair and play a little more modern type music. Then we'll sign you”. My response to that was “fuck off”, and I'm not going to sell my soul for fucking pennies. At that time, it was scary to see that Heavy Metal was being discriminated against. Also, it was scary to see that Heavy Metal somewhat underrated by the whole media and the labels collectively. It wasn't bad for us though, and that's as we had such a great time doing Headhunter. The music is about having a good time, having fun, going away from your environment and leaving your reality behind. That's fucking music, and we had that with Headhunter.
When A Bizarre Gardening Accident came out, you said that it was a bad time for Heavy Metal. Now the reissues are out and Heavy Metal seems strong, are those albums getting more appreciation now than they did back then?
I don't know. It's not really important that the re-releases get such wide appreciation.
Not from a critical perspective, but more from a fan perspective and so on?
Yeah. From their perspective, it's best to buy those albums. Of course, many people will now be thinking; “Yeah, Destruction is now a band once again. Heavy Metal is strong, and Schmier has finally re-released the Headhunter albums.” I could have done this many years earlier, although I didn't do it. I did it now because there's a demand, and I wanted to do it as they were asking for it. Believe me, Headhunter has roughly the same deal that Destruction does. So in fact, the money isn't so big. Actually, it's about finally giving the fans a chance to buy those albums. For me, this is a chance to launch another Headhunter album. If anything else happens, then I don't care. Now though, we're in a different situation. Without demand, you couldn't be in a situation like this. Without Headhunter being an interesting thing for the label, they wouldn't have signed a deal for the re-releases with the group. Of course it has to do with Destruction, but it also has to do with those three Headhunter albums. They have a certain kind of charm, and musical ability. Nobody can just summon those qualities, so that's also nice to see.
You said that Rebirth “is the most mellow Headhunter album in terms of the sound and the songwriting”, so could you tell me about that?
Rebirth is still my favourite album, and that's because I think it features our best songs. Maybe it could've been a little rougher, and really heavier. It definitely features a lot of great songs though, and that's why I really like the album. For the new album, I'm trying to maintain the level of good songs we had on that record - at least. We have a lot of good songs, but the new album will definitely be a little heavier than Rebirth. It'll retain the melodic aspects of that album though, and that's in terms of the lead guitars, vocals and so on. It's pretty cool.
Does this new Headhunter album have a working title?
A working title? It's too early. In November, we come back to England. We finally play England again. I'll have the Headhunter rough mixes, or the Headhunter promo tapes, so people can listen to them. Right now though, it's just too early to give anything away. I want to do it right, and I want to do it strong. It has to be good.
So you won't be able to reveal any song titles, or anything of that nature?
Right now?
Right now, yeah.
At the moment, we just have the demo tapes. I can't give you any song titles, and that's as they're going to be the eventual title of the songs. It's better that we possibly wait a little bit.
Ok. So, you would say that the new album is at a very early stage at the moment then?
Actually, it's at a really important stage right now. We're going to start going into the studio in two weeks, and record the album. Right now, it's still too early to tell you any song titles. We're doing spontaneous music with Headhunter, so we're going to change titles, change ideas, and change whole songs possibly. It doesn't make sense to give anything away. It's just going to be another four weeks of work for me now. We can then maybe give some demo tracks out to the press, and then we're going to master the material in roughly November. When we come back to the UK, I'm going to surely have some impressions of the album. I'm going to have some mixed, and mastered songs, from the album. Right now, it's just too early. Also, I don't want to put any pressure on us. It doesn't make sense. Really, fans should listen to the re-releases. People that don't know the albums will possibly have a new taste of what my voice is all about, and what I did in between Destruction. With anything else, it'll be later on. It's going to definitely be exciting to do that, but we don't want to give anything away too early.
You mentioned that you hope to do some live shows with Headhunter. Are there any shows set in stone yet, or not?
We always planned the album in a specific way; we wanted to do some festivals next year, and that'd be in the summer or autumn. After that, arranging anything else with Headhunter will be difficult. In short, we're busy men. First of all, we're having discussions with various other bands to play with. It's important that the album is good, first of all. The possibility of playing live is great, but we're going to keep it as professional as possible. We're possibly going to play some festivals, but we'll see. The most important aim is to play live shows, even though I play live shows with Destruction every year. With Headhunter, we'll have to see if every member has the chance to do that. First of all, we want to do this album. If anything happens afterwards, then it's a gift. I would love to play with Headhunter, but we'll see how it works out.
So there's no specific festivals?
No, and there's no specific tours. The funny part is that for the whole of 2007, things have been a little busy with Destruction. Fortunately, Headhunter is coming back. People are asking “ok, what's going on with Headhunter? Are you available for festivals?” and blah blah blah, so I'm telling all those people “Yeah, of course. We'll possibly be available for festivals”. Let's do the album first though, and then we'll play some gigs. We've already had initial offers for festivals, though I want to concentrate on the album at the moment. When the album is ready, then I'll focus on what's happening. We can then possibly talk about festivals, but not before that. Right now, the album is important. Apart from that, nothing else is really important. If the album receives attention and becomes as good as I think it will, then we can talk about everything else. First of all though, I'm still with Destruction.
Last month, Destruction performed at the Wacken Open Air festival for a live DVD.
Yeah. It's going to be released on a live DVD next year.
Would that be released on the same date during August of next year?
We're going to issue a whole DVD next year, and that'll be for Destruction's twenty-fifth anniversary. It's going to be a huge release. I'm working with the label right now, and trying to arrange it so that there's some special bonus material on our next album. There's possibly going to be some Wacken tracks as a special bonus, and some other bonus tracks on the next album as a twenty-fifth anniversary celebration of sorts. I want to get in touch with all the old Destruction members though, and have them talk about their time with Destruction. It'll be a massive documentary about Destruction, and that documentary will be included on the twenty-fifth anniversary album's bonus DVD. Of course, all that will include some Wacken tracks. The full length DVD will be out towards the end of next year. The documentary is definitely going to include the contributions of all the ex-members, and so on.
So it won't be one of those biographies which attempt to rewrite history so to speak?
It's going to be a nice track for the twenty-fifth anniversary album's bonus DVD. We'll talk about how everything started, and our original drummer will be involved in that. We'll then talk about the split with all the people involved, and it's definitely going to be a great look back. It's different though, and that's as we hadn't spoken to those people for many years. It's nice that we're all friends again, and that we can still talk about this. Also, it's nice we can show it to the fans. It'll be a real documentary, and will include all the actual people involved at the time. That part will be included on the twenty-fifth anniversary album's bonus DVD - it comes out on August 27^th I think.
Will that be a no holds barred type documentary? Will it be brutally honest?
It'll be brutal. That's going to celebrate our twenty-fifth anniversary, including the DVD. Also, we're still going to release the whole live DVD during the end of the year. The DVD on the album is just going to feature some live tracks, and have the whole documentary of the band with all the original members. We're then going to release the full length DVD at the end of the year. It's one of the best live performances of last year, so that's going to be cool.
How do you look back on all those years?
I look back in a good way. We're here, and still trying to learn. If bad things happen, then make them better and move on. If it doesn't kill you, then I believe it makes you stronger
How would you say things differ in Destruction now compared to when you left the band originally?
We have more control. There's less managers, less idiots telling us what to do, and less people trying to make cash out of the band. Now, we're more aware and have more respect for each other. People will tell you that everything was better in the eighties. Actually, Destruction has done a lot better since we reunited in 1999. We're having a great time, and we can finally tour the world. We're gaining respect from both the media, and the labels. For us, it's a good thing that we found the strength to move on and to not feel depressed.
Is there a lot more communication between the band members nowadays?
Of course. That's something you don't do when you're young. I guess there's more respect, and more communication. Otherwise, you can't continue on.
Over the last couple of years with Destruction, do you have a memory that stands out? A specific moment?
There's just been too many great moments. We've had some great moments performing at festivals of course, and going to some countries that we've never played before. South America is especially amazing, and crazy. Thousands of people wait for years. When you come to the airport, there's hundreds of people waiting at the airport. You feel like The Beatles.
Musically, how would you compare Destruction in the early days to now?
We're still trying to do the same thing; to deliver aggressiveness, but with original riffing. When referring to the way we play our music, we call it the music of Destruction. We sound different twenty years later of course, yet we're still trying to do the same thing. At that time in the eighties, we had the roughness but lacked the technical ability. We sound more tighter now, yet still unique. It's a matter of taste, I guess. People like the eighties because it's the start, and the origin of how Heavy Metal started. In the beginning, they called us noise. I'd like the chance to prove people wrong, and show that our fucking noise is still important. It's still a strong part of music, and we're all able to play and deliver rough music into the new millennium. Really, there's not been much change. I'm still as pissed off as I was in 1984, and I still feel the same strength in the band as I did back then. We've learnt a lot, and we're better players now. We've learnt a lot about the business, and it isn't going to be fucked around with as much as it has been in the past. If you compare how Destruction was before to how it is now, then you'll notice it's not a lot different - it's still the same kind of spirit, roughness, quickness and ability. For me, the change has been the obvious progression that Thrash Metal made.
Personally, I'm twenty. Therefore, I didn't grow up in the eighties as such. Nowadays, you seem to notice people saying how great the eighties were. From your perspective, were the eighties as great as people make out?
This is the thing about mankind. Don't you think that everybody tells you how things were better in the past? Ask anybody in your environment.
So you don't agree?
I really don't agree with that. In the eighties, we got ripped off, written off by the music industry, and we were mishandled by managers. Therefore, I really don't agree. I agree that the eighties were an important time for Heavy Metal, and I agree that some of the best music was written back then. I don't agree that the eighties was the most successful period for Heavy Metal though, and that's due to the fact that Heavy Metal has been developing over the years. I'm a big eighties fan, though you have to appreciate that the nineties was also a big step towards a new musical direction. That's when Death Metal became huge, and the same happened later on with other music. I think that the problem with mankind is that people always think about the past in a nice way. Imagine you've split up with your girlfriend. When you think back after some years, you'll always remember the good times with your girlfriend. You won't remember the bad times, and that's because you want to cling onto the good times. It's a human problem that we have. After some years, you always think that the past was great. It's not true, and that's because you forget the bad moments. You always push the bad moments away, and that's why I sometimes get annoyed when people talk about the eighties. We're an old school band, and we've been playing this fucking old school music for many years now. I don't think that anything in the eighties was great. It was a great start, and it was a great period. Nothing was outstandingly greater than it is now though. We have a better market at the moment, and better distribution. Also, we have more Heavy Metal fans all over the world. Since Destruction's return in 1999, we've finally had the chance to play those countries we've never played before. Those countries are religious areas that have had problems for example, like Turkey, or countries like Colombia that have been fighting for many years. This wasn't possible in 1981. Even America, the United States, is developing a really good Thrash underground. We've toured the United States for the last two years, and twice in a year even. Nothing about the past is really great. Really, they're trying to make the eighties sound better than they were. The foundation was important for all of us, but now it's important that the young people still believe in themselves. They need to stop believing it was such an important phase, or else the eighties will become a frozen period. People will then say that nothing except that era was great.
Destruction will be touring the UK in November, so what can people who buy tickets to the shows expect?
When you see Destruction live, we're going to deliver a lot of high aggression, tension and a lot of Thrash anthems. That means we're going to play a wide selection of songs, and those people wanting to hear the classics will finally hear them. I know those people have been waiting for years to see us. The young kids are waiting for new material, and for the newer anthems. Therefore, it's going to be a great mix. There's definitely going to be a lot of the classics; we're out there because we're a classic band, so obviously the program will feature the classic hits of the eighties. We're going to be playing all the new songs as well though, namely those that are newer Thrash anthems. Let's say it like this: Destruction never plays a headlining show under an hour and a half. We always play long shows, so we're going to have a big Thrash invasion in the UK soon.
So it's going to be a great night out for Thrash then?
It's going to be a great night out. Some people play one hour or less, but we're not doing this. We're out there to fucking thrash the place, and we've been waiting a long time for Destruction to come back to the UK. Some parts of the UK we haven't played for years. You can really expect a long set with all the classics, and our new songs. As for other Thrash bands, we're going to kick your fucking ass.
So when Destruction comes, the group is going to prove that Thrash is alive and kicking?
That was always the thing. When people quit the band, I felt to myself; “Fuck you, I'm going to kick your ass”. We've gone out there, and played all the big stages in past years - we've played alongside all the younger, hyped, well known bands. We've always kicked ass, and we've never held back. It's a challenge to get in the ring, and kick ass. By having that challenge, it'll make Destruction strong again. We're looking forward to finally meeting some of our long term fans that haven't had the chance to see us in awhile, so it's going to be great.
This is the last question now. Where would you like to take your career in the years to come?
I don't know. As a musician personally, I'm hundred percent satisfied. For me, the new challenges are going to countries where people haven't had the chance to see Heavy Metal bands. We get much mail from people, whether it be from China, from Taiwan, or from Korea. People write to us from places you wouldn't think of. There's lots of people writing from Iraq and Iran; Iran especially has a lot of Metal fans, and so does Morocco and places like that. For me, that would be the thing to break the ice for metal. We can go to these places, and show the world that Metal doesn't need any borders. I'm looking forward to doing that; it's going to happen in the next year.
Do you have a final message for fans of Destruction and Headhunter?
Yeah, of course. To those UK fans that especially waited for too long, I have to say I'm sorry. It's taken awhile, but sometimes good things take awhile. I broke my knuckle once, and that was when we were supposed to come over with Kreator. It didn't happen because I couldn't play my fucking bass. Now things are looking really good, and it looks like a really great tour. It has the fucking amazing Onslaught, so this will be a great old school tour. I'm sure this will also be a great chance for the new generation of thrashers to finally see Destruction and Onslaught, two of the eighties masters, together on a tour of the UK. I'm really looking forward to that, and I fucking thank all the people that kept the spirit. I want to see some of the old motherfuckers, people my age, coming to the shows. It's going to be hard, I know. I want to see some of the old motherfuckers coming to the shows though, and talk to them I'm forty, and many people my age don't come to the Metal shows anymore. So, I want to see that.
You just said that people your age don't seem to come to the Metal shows anymore. Do you feel that's a shame?
No. They have families etc., and have normal lives. Metal is about getting out of your normal life once in a while. I hope some of those people can still break out of that daily grind, and come to some of the shows.
Ok. Well thanks for the interview, I really appreciate it.
No problem man.
Alright. Take care.
Take care. I'll see you... where are you from?
Wales.
Ok. So we don't play Wales, right?
Yeah, Destruction will play Wales. Destruction will play in Newport.
I'll see you in Newport.
That's in Wales that is, not England. That's in Wales.
You'll come along to the show, right?
Yeah, I'll come along. Yeah, definitely.
Tell us who you are, and you can probably get a backstage pass from Mike. We can then have a beer together.
Alright, thank you very much.
Thank you.
Alright, take care. Bye.
Bye.